Where we stand

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Re: Where we stand

Post  Tim Fox-Godden on Fri Mar 26, 2010 8:17 am

The link did the same with me, it seems to be knocking the rugby union piece off the end. Hey ho, needless to say, I am pretty certain the other Daniel Carroll was not a dual national olympian!

I have heard back from the USARU who have duly forwarded my email to several members of their rugby history working group to see if any of them can help. I will let you know if any of them come up with anything.

I have also emailed the chap who posted the photograph on the link you provided, to establish the source.

Pip pip,

Tim
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USA WW1

Post  patrickcasey on Fri Mar 26, 2010 8:41 am

Excellent stuff
I think the USARU Histroy Group will be able to confirm many things.

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Re: Where we stand

Post  Tim Fox-Godden on Fri Mar 26, 2010 9:21 am

Right, I have heard back from the working group and they are being most helpful. They sent me a photo of the 1913 touring universities side, but, alas, this does not include either Gard or Noble. However, I have emailed to ask if they have any photos of the two test teams. Again, I await their response.

I have also heard back about the photo and biography of Noble, which are taken from the Knox County in the World War 1917-1918-1919.
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American Battlefield Monument Commission

Post  patrickcasey on Fri Mar 26, 2010 9:45 am

Tim have you been through every name?

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Re: Where we stand

Post  Tim Fox-Godden on Fri Mar 26, 2010 1:53 pm

I have been through every name on the ABMC.

However, I have not searched the CWGC yet. There were plenty of Americans who served and died with the British and wider commonwealth. For example, Dillwyn P. Starr, the Harvard American Footballer who was killed with the guards in September 1916.

It is a long shot, but needs to be covered.
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Re: Where we stand

Post  AdrianHunter on Mon Apr 05, 2010 2:13 pm

I have just received an email bid for Jack King & John Raphael of England by Paul Wapshott So good luck to him with his research Exclamation

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Re: Where we stand

Post  AdrianHunter on Wed Apr 07, 2010 11:51 am

From Patrick Casey by Email:-

Please put me down for:

David Bedell-Sivright ("Darkie Bedell-Sivright"), died on 5 September 1915, Aged 35
James Laidlaw Huggan, died on 16 September 1914, Aged 25
Ronald Francis Simson, died on 14 September 1914, Aged 24
Stephen Sebastian Leonard Steyn, died on 8 December 1917, Aged 28
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I am happy to do

Post  patrickcasey on Sat May 08, 2010 6:59 am

If we add these men I am happy to do them
Charlie Adamson (English), died on 17 September 1918, Aged 43. As he plyed for Bristol I feel I am obliged to say yes
Noel Forbes Humphreys MC (Welsh), died 27 March 1918, Aged 27

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WW1

Post  patrickcasey on Wed Jun 09, 2010 1:56 am

Put me down for the NZ players Dewar, Downing and Sellars.
A couple of points on the NZ players Kaipara and Wilson
As I understand it Kaipara played for the New Zealand Maoris and never played for the All Blacks
Wilson played for New Zealand against club sides and never played in an international.

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Put me down for

Post  patrickcasey on Tue Jun 22, 2010 3:14 am

Australia
Edward Larkin, died on 25 April 1915, Aged 34
Blair Swannell, 25 April 1915, Aged 39

New Zealand
Hubert Sydney Turtill ("Jum" Turtill), died on 9 April 1918, Aged 38

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WW1

Post  pinkernel on Wed Jun 23, 2010 6:12 pm


Put me down for Ronald Poulton Palmer, please.

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Re: Where we stand

Post  AdrianHunter on Thu Jun 24, 2010 5:52 am

Will do Laughing

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Good Resource

Post  AdrianHunter on Sat Jul 17, 2010 6:09 am

For all of you beavering away researching players this link has been sent in by James Corsan. I have used the site myself & it can be very helpful!

WW1 Talk Sportsmen & Women

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HR Stolz USA

Post  rugbyremembers on Thu Aug 12, 2010 6:22 am

Apologies for joining this rather late. It looks that all the Rosslyn Park England players are neatly covered - Dingle, Todd, Harrison - and I know a certain amount about Jean Jacques Conilh de Beyssac, (although some frustration in contacting relatives here). If I can get more, I am happy to be his author.

My eye alit on HR Stolz, a replacement in one one of the American teams. He played for Rosslyn Park in 1911. Memory (fallible) tells me he may have been an Oxford blue too... to be checked.

Has anyone found the US version of CWGC that would tell me if he qualifies for inclusion in my list of RPFC in memoriam i.e did he die in WW1. Or is the list of internationals died below in Adrian's summary, the gospel version?

With various Aussies, South Africans, a Frenchman and near-miss Swede called von Braun who survived (how many times do you think he had to explain he was Swedish?!) it would be fascinating to have an American.
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H.R. Stoltz

Post  pinkernel on Thu Aug 12, 2010 7:41 am

Not sure if this helps, but I've just had a look through my copy of the "CENTENARY HISTORY OF OXFORD UNIVERSITY RUGBY FOOTBALL CLUB 1869-1969" by Ross McWhirter and Sir Andrew Noble (Oxford University RFC, 1969) and Stolz does not appear in their comprehensive list of those awarded an Oxford Blue up to 1969.

Instead, it mentions Donald Herring (later Lieut-Colonel Donald Grant Herring), a forward, as being the first American to gain a rugby Blue, in 1909.

Born 6th September 1886, he was educated at Lawrenceville School, Princeton University and Merton College. A Rhodes Scholar, he also played for Rosslyn Park.

Herring also won a Blue for Athletics, coming third in the Hammer with 122 feet. He had been an inter-collegiate heavyweight wrestling champion in the USA.

He served in France with the 94th Pursuit Squadron (in which Edward Rickenbacker also served) in the United States Air Force from 1917 to 1919.

He later taught at Princeton, farmed and then went into the oil business.

Herring died on 20th October 1968.

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Re: Where we stand

Post  rugbyremembers on Thu Aug 12, 2010 8:01 am

This is all great learning. DG Herring is indeed another Park name, but i was not aware he was American and it would therefore seem that Park had an influx of Yanks from Oxford. A quick Google reveals that Herring was an advocate of replacing Amercical football with rugby - good luck with that!

Herring survived the war and so does not qualify for the book! ( I feel gulty even saying it...) There might be a book of survivors to be written - a novel twist for WW1.

Clearly memory is fallible on Stolz as a Blue, but he rings a bell somewhere. For a while I cherished the notion that RPFC may have had a German player, just as we had a Frenchman - Park toured Germany and Austria before the war playing exhibition games and you just never know. Stolz leapt out at me, as did von Braun the Swede. I vaguely recall that Ldn Scottish had a Schultze who changed his name, but then so did the Battenburgs and Saxe-Coburgs!
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Where we stand

Post  Sorcerer on Fri Jan 25, 2013 9:19 am

A couple of corrections to your list of Wales Internationals :

1). Charles Pritchard's 2nd name should read "MEYRICK".

2). I have RDG Williams as killed in action 27th Sept 1915.

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WW1 cancelled?

Post  rugbyremembers on Wed Jan 08, 2014 7:04 am

Chaps,

Hate to be the Grinch, but is the WW1 project now history as Nigel McCrery's book covers the ground? How well I do not know, but it's out Jan 13.

Stephen
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Re: Where we stand

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